And from that we are to conclude...what?

Roy

As I mentioned earlier, CA have a number of Oracle tools to promote.
We collaborate and compete with not just Oracle, but Microsoft, IBM,
HP, Sun.... If we decided not to offer products for companies we
compete with in other areas, then we wouldn't have a great deal of
business to do with anyone. I think one posting in this thread
mentioned that the problem with Ingres within CA was management
related. We now have a very senior manager championing our cause and
things are changing for the better. Whether at CA World, User Group
Meetings, Ingres World, various roadshows the message you'll hear is
the same.

Just a footnote about the Oracle pricing. The $4995 quoted is for
Standard Edition One on a box with up to two processors. If you want
to get into 'serious' applications with clustering, table partitioning
and the like, then you have to move up to Enterprise Edition at
$40,000 per processor plus the cost of the options ($10,000 or $20,000
each).

We will be making significant announcements of our own soon. Watch
this space.

Best regards,

Jim Callaghan
Computer Associates
Product Manager

I would tend to agree.
However, I think the point was the way each company makes it's own partnership policy.
Now, don't get me wrong as if I would go Oracle church.
But one would have to be realistic in the mean time.
Some comments pointed out.

Platinum acquisition from CA maybe it did something good. But I can say from my experience that it was a nightmare by integrating PLatinum management and dropping them into Ingres and Unicenter TNG future customers relationship. I have seen big deals and i mean BIG screwed this way in a blink of an eye.
It is great that Ingres is embedded but how will it be exploited to it's advantage ?
I doubt one business running Oracle let's say will dive into Ingres.
Ingres looks great you say. It is , but technically and that is to be credited to people like Karl, Roy, Mark, DMT folks etc which do a heck of a job.
But sorry to say that, CA wise it is just a shame.
When talking to CA guys in New York , they claimed that there are at least 70 (SEVENTY) Ingres big sites in New York City area. When trying to call an Ingres User Group meeting in NY CIty, well, virtually nobody showed up. They declined like plague was about to hit them. The same goes about success stories. Let alone other dropping contracts like they would hold a hot pan in their bare hands. See Nextel.
CA World last year was kinda shy on Ingres.
And really, me personally I heard the same tune from CA for the last 8 years at least. It will be  such and such and I keep wondering WHEN?
So the theory with Charlie Wang while driving his bike off from CA headquarters left such a bad heritage, just doesn't fly. It is about management, attention and listen to customers, consultants , users. You have not even a big one, but a damn great pool of sharp guys and partners. Work with them and listen to them. One of them is DMT. And if they need something or they signal something, wake up and just do it.
Ah, users' group. If I recall CA World was last summer. Haven't heard anything since then. So, how about putting some one even hyperactive to manage this but to move things in high gear effective ?
As a conclusion, don't blame anyone, but Ingres dudes have all the rights in this world to be upset and to moan and grind.
And CA should do something. Not only developing great things on Ingres but also to improve customers' relationship bahavior, getting rid of sending invoices for things that do not exist, adverstising, free pilot projects (to win trust technically speaking), listening and taking action fast and not sipping coffee,  but please not with those hens on Brooklyn Bridge and that guy that falls under the desk.
If one would peek only at how Oracle is doing business would learn something.
And well if it is not understandable, maybe a little zen mediation will help and also maybe a lecture of Art of War would help.
'Cause business is war with competitors. Not just flying business class.
As to database market, I haven't seen any report where Ingres would show up.
We know it is the best, but it is not enough.
Should I say that tech support needs some huge improvement? Me personally I had great support most of the times and from certain dudes within CA. But other than that, well well, not a nice picture.

I hope you will listen one day (which would have to be today). And I hope it will not be too late.

Cheers,
Armand

P.S. It is not about prophets, but of some realistic sense. Given the current market and how it evolves, it kinda looks like the question is not IF but WHEN.

"Roy Hann" wrote in message news:...

Just to re-iterate Roy's posting, the Platinum acquisition brought a
range of Oracle management tools to CA's portfolio. It also made CA
one of Oracle's biggest partners. Likewise, we partner with Microsoft
on the enterprise management, security and backup side of the business
whilst going head to head with SQL Server. None of this has had an
adverse effect on CA's commitment to Ingres, nor indeed will it. If
people are looking for a great database, then we'll happily sell them
Advantage Ingres. Should they choose to take the Oracle route, then we
are just as happy to sell them the tools they need to manage it
effectively.

As part of our commitment to 'Drink Our Own Champagne', Ingres is
being embedded in an increasing number of CA products across all
brands, and will become the de-facto database for all CA products,
replacing Oracle and SQL Server.

In the meantime, product development continues apace and there will be
a new release launched later this year. Come to CA World and see
what's in store or failing that, come to your next local user group
meeting. There will also be an Ingres World conference later in the
year in Kansas City so regardless of where you are, there will be
ample opportunity to find out in detail what's going on rather than
listening to the marketing machine of our competitors.

The future for Advantage Ingres has never looked better and with the
10th anniversary of the ASK acquisition only a few months away, the
prophets of doom have been proved totally wrong. It's still here and
it's not going away!

Best regards,

Jim Callaghan
Computer Associates
Product Manager, Advantage Ingres

---------------------------------
Do you Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Finance: Get your refund fast by filing online

Marketing people are supposed to say things like that, but in
fact Jim is if anything understating the case. :-)

I have been *very* busy the last few months,
along with the rest of the DBMS development team.
No, don't bother asking me what to expect in the new release,
you'll just have to wait and see!  Ingres is indeed alive and well.
Make your World reservations...

Karl